Dear Barrett.

Thank you for the link. Didn’t know there are such strictly political articles connected with the skeptical inquirer.

You and me came into contact via what you wrote about science and science journalism. I am also all for transparency in political affairs. However, I am just not an expert on the middle east and would be useless in that respect. So, a split of your PM project sounds good.

Allow me also some general remarks that you may find counter revolutionary conservative reactionary:

1) That islam related fundamentalism may take over those new ‘democracies’ is a fear that alone is not immediately islamophobic or racist or whatnot.

2) Humans are not rational or intelligent enough systems for western type ‘democracy’ to work. For example, if you wanted to help overthrow the Chinese government in similar ways, I would be your enemy. All that could possibly follow after a fall of China is a region worse than the middle east with the west actively working on that it stays that way, just like they now do with the middle east.

3) If it is not the King and his henchmen killing you before the revolution or the mob killing you during the revolution, it will be the revolutionaries after charging each other with treason to the true meaning of the cause. Some day you may remember this young man, wishing you did not shrug it off like you do now while driven in the current adrenaline fueled rush. ;-)  Julian has a taste of it already.

If you can stomach the above without going into knee-jerk reactions, we can work together even on internet freedom in China, but I doubt it needs hushmail. Call me ridiculous if you will, but given the sheer threat of the US under Palin in a few years, there is little that I would like to propose that I would not be comfortable with proposing to the politburo itself, i.e. within the framework of longterm stability and against leading to the average Chinese (read: chain smoking, uneducated, racist patriots trying to impress by copying the worst from the west) to take to the streets. This may change some day, but as long as Hu Jintao, a scientist after all, and modest people like him are first among equals in a group of secular intellectuals deciding by consensus… .

Have a good day
Sascha


-----------------------------------------------------------------
Dr. Sascha Vongehr  (风洒沙)
Department of Philosophy and
National Laboratory of Solid-State Microstructures
Dept of Materials Science and Engineering
Nanjing University, Kexue Jishu Guan 324, Hankou Lu 22,
Nanjing, Gulou District, Jiangsu Province 210093, P.R. China
http://www.science20.com/alpha_meme
Alternate mail: vongehr8@yahoo.com
http://cn.LinkedIn.com/in/SaschaVongehr

----- Original Message -----
From: Barrett Brown <barriticus@gmail.com>
Date: Thursday, February 17, 2011 12:00 pm
Subject: Re: Project PM split
To: sascha vongehr <vongehr@usc.edu>

Sascha-

Here you go, thanks. Also, I am in early talks with Janik Radon, 
who wrote
majority of Nepal's post-civil war constitution, to write a suggestive
framework for Tunisia. Am assembling a team on our end. Get back to 
me,please.

http://www.csicop.org/specialarticles/show/skepticism_in_the_face_of_evidence_is_no_virtue

On Wed, Feb 16, 2011 at 9:58 PM, sascha vongehr <vongehr@usc.edu> 
wrote:

Thanks for the update. Could you give me a link to the skeptical 

inquirer> column, I do not find it on

http://www.csicop.org/si/archive/category/column

Sascha

-----------------------------------------------------------------
Dr. Sascha Vongehr  (风洒沙)
Department of Philosophy and
National Laboratory of Solid-State Microstructures
Dept of Materials Science and Engineering
Nanjing University, Kexue Jishu Guan 324, Hankou Lu 22,
Nanjing, Gulou District, Jiangsu Province 210093, P.R. China
http://www.science20.com/alpha_meme
Alternate mail: vongehr8@yahoo.com
http://cn.LinkedIn.com/in/SaschaVongehr

----- Original Message -----
From: Barrett Brown <barriticus@gmail.com>
Date: Thursday, February 17, 2011 8:12 am
Subject: Project PM split
To: sascha vongehr <vongehr@usc.edu>, Mano Singham 

<mano.singham@case.edu>,> Todd Essig <tessig@me.com>, Sundeep 
Gottipati <gsundeep@gmail.com>, Clark

Robinson <robinsonchicago@gmail.com>, Campbell Vertesi <
campbell@vertesi.com>, Scott Mintz <scott.w.mintz@gmail.com>, 

Barry Eisler

<barryeisler@mac.com>, Seb Gillen <sebgillen@gmail.com>, Ayla 

Noland <

ayla.noland@gmail.com>

Howdy-

As some of you know, due to my having taken a more central role in
Anonymousover the past two months, I am splitting Project PM into
two different
groups. One will continue with myself, a group of PM folks, and
Anonymousparticipants in pursuing our aid projects for Africa and
the Middle East
while also carrying on with things like HBGary, and those who are
uncomfortable with these newer projects for any reason can work 

with> > Campbell Vertesi, Clark Robinson, and a number of other PM 
folks as

well as
whomever else joins them as our recruiting continues. You can also
be a
participant in both groups and I hope that many of you will, 

and I

thinkCampbell and I will be better able to describe what each
respective group
will do when our other participants have decided individually 

on what

they'll be interested in doing and with whom. Let me know if you
have any
questions. For an explanation of why we're doing what we are,
please see
tomorrow's Guardian op-ed, today's al-Jazeera op-ed signed
Anonymous, my
Skeptical Inquirer column from today, or read up on Anonymous in
general.Again, though, I'm happy to provide a fuller 

explanation of

what's going on
to anyone who'd like to hear it. I believe Campbell will also be
sending out
some info soon that will be of use in deciding.

Thanks again to all of you for everything. Please forward this to
anyone you
know who's expressed interest in what we're doing.

-- 
Regards,

Barrett Brown
512-560-2302